Tasting Day - Funky Flanders Sour Saison

Decided to crack into one of these tonight.  Good news – this beer shows that I have learned from my first "Quick Sour" and improved on this one.  Bad news - if you look through my previous posts you know that it took a lot to get to this point.  A lot of issues happend with this brew.  Luckily I was able to save the beer and have some brew to taste.  Big thanks to Mike over at the Mad Fermentationist for helping me with a solid yeast selection to get the stuck fermentation moving again.

Overview: A Flanders Red Sour that was created with a sour mash with a mix of dark candi syrup and cherry tart syrup.  Fermented with California Ale yeast and then Wyeast French Saison to get the beer down to the appropriate gravity (stuck fermentation). This was two beers that did not go as planned so they were mixed.  I dont really know what the IBU or ABV is on this beer.  It tastes pretty strong though.

Appearance:  This is one category that I improved on.  The color is a more traditional deep copper red color - almost brown. Big white head of foam that dissipates pretty quickly and leaves a thin white layer.

Smell: Biggest aroma is alcohol.  This makes me believe this is a high octane brew. Hidden behind the alcohol is a small lactic sour smell.

Taste: Pretty much tastes like it smells.  Alcohol is up front with some very faint lactic sour flavors.  Also hidden in there is some complex "Belgian" flavors.  Some of those flavors are the classic pepper flavor from some saisons and some fruit flavors.  I think the fruit flavor is coming from the dark candi syrup vs the tart cherry syrup because the taste has no cherry or tartness to it.  I taste the cherry well after I take a sip.  It has a bit of a cough medicine fruity flavor that follows everything else.  Overall pretty complex.  Maybe too complex.  We will see how it ages in the bottle.

Mouth:  Medium-light body.  Seems right for the style I was going after. Carbonation is great. Much better than the last attempt.

Overall:  As stated above, this is a much better effort.  I would grade my last "Qucik Sour" as a 2 out of 10.  This one may be a 4 out of 10.  Keep in mind this is based on the idea of creating a quick sour.  Not in the same playing field as the traditionally aged sours so my grading is based on this particular circumstance – not out of all beers possible.  This beer needs less alcohol flavor and some more lactic funk.


Will I have another.  Sure.  Will I run to get another one. Probably not.  
Progress has been made and I have learned a lot with this stubborn beer so it's a success in my mind.

I will be trying some of the other mixes I made in the next few weeks and post results for each one.

Bottle Day: 100% Singularite

It is a week late but I finally bottled the 100% Singularite.  Smelled like a fruitier version of a simple pale ale.  Should be pretty dry.  The FG is currently reading at 1.010 and I assume that to go done a bit more while in the bottle conditioning stage.

Here are some photos from the bottle day:

You can kind of see the dusty pellicle that the Brett Claus created.  Again, this beer is 100% Brett C.  The "S" on the carboy is for "Sour".  I have sectioned off my equipment so I do not infect any of my other beers.

This is what it looked like after 5 weeks in the secondary.  This brew started on January 27th and has gone into the bottle on March 19th.

This is a view into the carboy.  You can see the pellicle a bit better and the pieces of "dust".

A lot of the pellicle dropped out once I moved it into my bottle room - AKA on top of my washer.

It really picked up growth in the last week to week and a half

Here is a blurry view of the hydrometer reading.  In this photo it looks like it may even be down to 1.008.  This is one of the clearest and lightest beers I have ever brewed.  I imagine ALL of the flavor is going to come from the yeast.  Should be interesting once it is time to taste. 

Can't wait to try it.

I will probably due a tasting in about two weeks and see how it is going and leave the majority sit for a month.

Funk with Less Fuss: Update 3

So today was the day for the California yeast to finally kick in.

Three beers and all three started on different days. Here is how it ended up.

• Mixed Fermentation started after one day.
• 100% Brett B. started on day two
• California Yeast started on day three.

According to the schedule I will let the mixed fermentation go until Tuesday of next week and check on the airlock activity.  If it has slowed I will move it to secondary storage for 8 weeks at warmer temps (~80)

100% Brett B will sit in the primary for 2 weeks.  So that will be checked on March 27th. Secondary will be 4 weeks after that at 55 degrees or as cold as I can keep it to that temp.

The California Ale yeast will just sit in the primary until I see no airlock activity - usually a week which would make it March 21st.  I will then transfer over to a secondary to clear it out for two weeks at cooler temps.

Next update will be next week once we check in on the Mixed Ferm and the Cali brews.

Till then...

Funk with Less Fuss: Update 2

The 100% Brett B. started to shows signs two days after the yeast was added.  Around 50-55 hours later and it is a very vigorous fermentation with the need for a blow off tube.

Still no signs of activity on the 100% California Yeast.

Funk with Less Fuss: Update 1

24 hours after the boil and adding the yeast there is a bit of information to report.  Out of the three different fermentation experiments only one has taken off. 

Ale Yeast - No activity at all. 
100% Brett Brux - No activity at all.
Mixed Fermentation with ale yeast and a mix of bugs - A lot of activity.  This is sitting in a picnic cooler to keep the temp closer to the high 70's - 80 degree mark to test the fermentation schedule as outlined in the Wild Brews book.  It will sit for 8 weeks before bottling at 80 degrees.

Plan is to watch the other two and hope fermentation kicks in within the next 24-48 hours. More to come as it happens.

Funk with Less Fuss - Phase 2

Lacto starter. Small pellicle showing on the top.
A nice sweet sour smell.

Phase 1one in the Funk with Less Fuss project was creating the lacto starter.


I made the lacto starter for the Funk with Less Fuss experiment on Wednesday night.  I check the starter yesterday morning and it looked perfect.  A very thin pellicle with a strong sweet/sour smell.  From previous experience I learned that it does not take long for the sweet sour smell to fade into nail polish.  So after getting the Sour Stout put to bed I moved on to the Funk with Less Fuss brew.

I mashed in my grains as usual.  This recipe is based of a clone for the Duchesse De Bourgogne that I found in a thread. After a 75 minute mash I brought the beer to a boil to kill of any unwanted critters.  It boiled for ten minutes.

Once the wort cooled to 110 degrees I strained the grain from the lacto starter into a picnic cooler.  The idea is to hold the temperature right around 100 degrees for 24-36 hours.  

Since I want this to be noticeably sour, I am going to let it sit beyond 24 hours.  Only problem is that I have to work on Monday. By the time I get home and start the boil it will be getting close to 42-44 hours from inoculation. 

I will taste/check in on the wort tonight and see where it stands.  I think I can chill the wort down so it does not encourage as much lacto growth if it is closer than I expected. 

Monster Brew Day

Yesterday was a nice day.  Actually seemed likes spring was on the way.  I have been waiting for a warmer Saturday so I can brew some a larger recipe outside with a full boil.

I ended up making two base beers yesterday.  One is a sour stout inspired by the "Tart of Darkness" from the Bruery and the "Dark Dawn" from Jolly Pumpkin.

Here are some photos from the brew day:

Mash in. The grain bill was a pretty basic stout. The majority of the flavor is going to come from the bugs.

Pale ale, Oats, Crystal 60L, Black and a some Chocolate made up the grain list for the mash.

It was nice outside so it was time to head outside and brew this 5 gallon batch.  Only a small portion of Saaz was added to the boil for the full 60 minutes.

Sanitizing the wort chiller.  I let this sit outside for 45 minutes to get just a bit of the terroir after the boil and then chilled to 75-80 degrees.

After it cooled. I transferred to a plastic bucket.  The plastic bucket will let in more air and closer replicate the wooden barrels than a glass carboy.  It will stay in this bucket for the full 8-12 months.  I noticed once the transfer finished that I got a crazy amount of boil off.  I started with 6.75 gallons of wort and only ended up with 4.5 after the boil.  I added some DME and water to get the hydrometer reading back up to where it should of been.  I still came in lower than expected at 1.053.  It will still be 5.4% or more in alcohol once the bacteria and wild yeast eat through everything.

After shaking the bucket around ot get some oxygen in there for the yeast I added a combo.  American Ale Dried yeast, Belgian Sour Mix and dregs from two Jolly Pumpkin Dark Dawn Stouts.  Time to sit in the dark for 8-12 months.








On top of this beer I also moved on to the second steps for the Funk with Less Fuss.  I will make a new post for this to keep them all together.

Bottle Day: Mixing and Matching: Funky Flanders Sour Saison

The day has finally come.  I bottled the Funky Flanders Sour Saison or Frank (short for Frankenstein) beer.

I did not get too much sour flavor from the FFSS by itself. It had "something" but it was not too tart. Really curious how this one develops.

With the lackging sour bite and because I ran into so many problems with this beer, I decided to try mixing with some different beers I had on hand to see what kind of flavors I could get.  Here is a run down on the 6 different types of beer.

Bottles and beer ready for mixing.

First I will start with the beers used for mixing.  A brief description of each beer that I tasted before mixing.

1. Funky Flanders Sour Saison - Frank - strong red with some saison and some lactic flavors
2. Spigs Sour - over 4 years old.  Real nice and tart.  Serious, Serious funk.
3. Singularite - This is my 100% Brett C. beer.  It is a nice light pale ale with some fruity notes from the Brett and a bit of dank flavors - nothing too crazy.
4. Roosters Red - I found the bottles I saved from my first "Quick Sour" test.  And quess what?  They taste a bit better and developed a bit more flavor in month 3 in the bottle.

Six different bottles and varieties made from 4 beers.

With these I made 6 different varieties

1. 100% FFSS - Frank
2. 66% Frank and 33% Spigs Sour
3. 66% Frank and 33% Roosters Red
4. 66% Frank and 33% Singularite
5. 33% Frank, 33% Singularite and 33% Spigs
6. 50% Frank, 16.67% Rooster, 16.67% Singularite and16.67% Spigs.

I primed each bottle with 1 tsp. of priming sugar.  This is the first time I did not batch prime so I hope it goes OK.

Due to all the flavors that have just been mixed I plan to check back in and do a tasting of the 100% FFSS Frank Beer in three weeks.  After that I will drink the ones that are just a mix of two, then three and then the crazy one at the end with 4 mixes.

Project Plan: Funk with Less Fuss

I have been working hard to recover a few beers that have not quit turned out. I have combined them, used multiple yeast cultures to get through a stuck fermentation and this Frankenstein beer (may be a good name for it) is coming to an end.  I can finally get back to testing some more methods.

I found the article "Funk with Less Fuss: A Shortcut to Sour Beers" by Matt Lange in Zymurgy. Without knowing it, I have been somewhat doing this procedure that he outlines in my previous testing.  It was probably outlined in another blog site or message board and  I started to use that process. Here is the general run down of what I did:

1. Mash
2. Cool collected wort
3. Add a handful of crushed grain to the wort.
4. Let grain and wort sit for 3 days or until the pellicle formed
5. Strain pellicle and grain from wort
6. Boil wort as normal
7. Cool wort
8. Add yeast
9. Wait.

I ran into these problems:

1. Fermentation go stuck
2. Beer was not "clean".  Even after a 60 minute boil I saw signs of lacto taking hold - mainly a pellicle.  I don't know if this was from a contaminated bucket or what...

This is what lead to the Frankenstein Beer that is currently being called Funky Flanders Sour Saison in my previous posts.

Here is what Matt outlines in the article though:

1. Create a Lacto Starter - as described in earlier posts
2. Let starter sit for 3 days
3. On last day of the lacto starter mash your grains
4. Once all wort is collected bring the wort to a boil.
5. Cool wort to ~100 and pitch the liquid from the lacto starter
6. Let the wort and the starter sit at 100 for 18-24 hours.
7. Boil wort once the acid level is to your liking
8. Cool Wort
9. Add yeast 
10. Wait

The one main thing I see is that the wort was boiled twice to kill of bacteria after mash and during the main 60-90 minute boil.  Maybe my mash had some nasty bacteria present that just messed with the beer.  Maybe I soured it too long and the pH just dropped to far out of range of the California Ale yeast from White Labs.  Bottom line is that my method did not work out too well and I don't intend to try it again.

I have the grain and yeast to begin a new test batch which I plan to start this week.  The batch I have will make 3 gallons.  I will do the the process from the Funk with Less Fuss article but at step #9 listed above, I will ferment three different ways.

• 1 Gallon will be fermented with an Ale yeast (5 weeks minimum)
• 1 Gallon will be fermented with 100% Brett Brux (8 weeks minimum)
• 1 Gallon will be fermented with Mixed Culture yeast at higher temps as outlined in the Flanders Red Ale recipe in Wild Brews by Jeff Sparrow. (11 weeks minimum)

Each type will increase with age but should also increase in complexity.
They will all sit on oak cubes during their secondary stages.

I will save a bottle from each sample and have one day where we will test them side by side.  This will come after I grade them on their own.

This Wednesday I will start with making the Lacto starter.
I will post updates as they happen.